*The BIGGEST* Bear at Morgan Stanley JUST Flip Flopped
FULL TRANSCRIPT
Morgan Stanley is a flip-flopping I
would have not expected this not at all
but Morgan Stanley's Mike Wilson the
mega bear okay remember he's the guy who
says stocks are going to hell the
recession's gonna stop suck it's going
to be way worse than you expect and
basically anybody who's a bull right now
is essentially sucking air on Mount
Everest which is so oxygen depleted that
clearly you're getting delusional
because you're not able to think clearly
because obviously the stock market's
going down that's been Mike Wilson's
argument and I remember I made a video
about that amount Everest a piece that
he put out and I thought it was so
ludicrous I thought to myself holy
smokes now the Bears are getting
delusional in other words the Bears are
starting to run out of crap to say about
this economy because the reality is is
the consumers and businesses have a lot
more money than anybody previously
thought and it's lasting a whole lot
longer than anybody ever thought it
would so yes while things are trending
bad we seem to have more fuel in the gas
to keep this plane flying for a lot
longer than we thought a lot more fuel
in the gas tank
uh which would essentially coincide with
this idea of well maybe the plane
doesn't have to land yet and maybe we
can be patient in getting inflation down
before markets actually go into that
sort of Mike Wilson recession but anyway
my opinion aside Mike Wilson actually
just changed his tune a little bit and
I'd like to read you a quote take a
listen to this
Equity markets survived a crucial test
of support last week that suggests this
bear Market rally is not ready to end
yet he specifically pointed out the Spy
basically bouncing off of the SMA 200
line which you could see that
specifically here we've talked about it
many a time before but here's your SMA
uh 200 line your simple daily moving
average and that 200 daily moving
average showed you support at about 390
we ended up getting to a low of about
392 before bouncing off and closing at
about 401 a pretty uh pretty pretty
traumatic uh moves we've seen over here
uh anyway I mean boy that is actually
pretty dramatic I mean if you had a low
of 392 and you ended up closing at 401
what is that uh 401 divided by 392. okay
yeah it's about a 2.2 percent swing from
from previous low to to next state close
that's not even next day high which was
404 that's more like a three three and a
half percent that's remarkable but
anyway Mike Wilson is now calling this a
short-term pivot he does however still
reiterate that once the fundamentals
deteriorate then the real pain will come
he says this doesn't change the quote
very poor risk reward ratio currently
offered by many stocks
given valuations and earnings forecasts
that remain way too high in other words
Mike Wilson is saying look people are
just going to run out of money people
are going to have money for for to
sustain earnings anymore and then
earnings are going to disappoint margins
are going to disappoint and you're going
to have a pretty nasty crash and that
the real pain is still ahead of us
that's the Mike Wilson point now he says
the gap between reported earnings and
cash flow a cash flow is the widest that
it's been in 25 years driven by excess
inventory and capitalized costs that
have yet to be reflected in earnings per
share so in other words
when you spend a bunch of money but you
capitalize it you basically spread the
expenses over time and so when those
spread expenses hit in the future when
people finally stop spending as much
money we're going to the hell is
basically what Mike Wilson's trying to
say and now he's trying to hedge his
argument that everything's going to Hell
by basically saying okay well fine maybe
maybe the rally will last a little bit
longer but don't worry the bear Market's
coming I promise I think that's really
interesting because yeah they've they've
been you know Mike Wilson has been sort
of a bear for quite a while now he was
right about uh you know the bearishness
that we saw last year but then again
every bear was right last year at one
point I spent two months as a pair I
posted pictures of me skiing uh uh last
January and it was basically just a
picture of a bear with skis on the ski
lift all alone a very sad lonely bear
uh but what I always like to do is I try
to look at some of the other information
that we're getting from other analysts
specifically even within Mike within
Morgan Stanley I personally wonder if
all these people at Morgan Stanley are
in the same office and they've like put
Mike Wilson in a corner and then you've
got like the level-headed people on the
main floor that are kind of like there's
Mike again ah poor Mike like I I don't
know I don't know and who knows maybe
he'll end up being ripe but here's yet
another piece from Morgan Stanley which
is basically the opposite uh and what I
thought was interesting about this one
and I I try to read everything right I
try to read the bear case and I tried to
read the bull case and when I hear the
Bears arguing that don't worry the pain
will come and you must be on Mount
Everest because the oxygen is getting
thin it makes me think like dude you're
running out of facts and when you're
running out of facts to support the bear
case the bear case is going to go away
like so far people and businesses still
have lots of money and and I think
that's the big thing that everyone is
missing is just I want to just grab them
by the shoulders
now on one hand that could be really bad
because we could actually confirm a
meaningful re-acceleration of inflation
right if in January if the January
numbers uh re-accelerate in or continue
to prove and re-acceleration here in in
February with the data we're getting in
March we're screwed
Mark Mike Wilson's gonna be right then
okay and in fact look you already know
this right you already know that coming
up we have a jobs report on the 10th we
got CPI on the 14th and then we get the
FED on the 22nd you already know this
but something that we haven't talked
about before is that you should not pay
attention specifically to those reports
you know what you want to pay attention
to you want to pay attention to the
following
the revisions I want you to look at the
January revisions when this data comes
out pay attention to the January
revisions because here's the best case
scenario in my opinion best case
best case we get the Feb data the Feb
data comes in slightly soft okay I mean
the softer it is obviously the better
but you want the FED data to come in
soft but then you want the Jan data to
be revised down because the Jan data was
so ridiculous with seasonal adjustments
I'm really hoping for revision down
I just want to be really clear here
before I keep going through this Morgan
Stanley piece if the data for January
gets revised down
and you get soft February data I think
we break through the next levels of
support on the retracement levels for
everything Bitcoin spy Tech Tesla I
don't care what you're investing in AMC
oh you know it's not my fault if you
want to invest in bankrupt code I mean
in AMC uh you know like it's all going
up that would be great so
revisions pay attention to those really
really important but what's Morgan
Stanley saying over here so Morgan
Stanley suggests that hey in the coming
weeks we'll get more data duh we know
that but Morgan Stanley believes right
now that the FED will only require two
more
price hikes or or interest rate hikes
now that's interesting because we've
really been talking about this idea of
maybe a pause after March until that
January data came out after that January
data came out everybody's like oh crap
yep we're going to end up seeing rates
go up higher for longer and so now we're
pricing in that uh that hike in um in
may as well in fact if we look at
Futures pricing we're about a 71 chance
of getting a 25 BP hike oh wow that's
actually bullish uh in a uh a 28 chance
of a 50 BP hike now I think that's
ludicrous I think there's almost no
chance we get a 50 BP hike unless of
course the data comes in like terribly
bad the data would have to be so so bad
for jobs and CPI to get a 50. because it
would just shoot The fed's credibility
and foot for what they have left and
then when we look at May
we're looking at probably a somewhere
between a yeah it's about a 90 95 chance
that we're gonna be up at five and a
quarter to five and a half so yeah it's
actually closer to like 97 but anyway
pretty pretty much a foregone conclusion
that by May we're gonna be at five and a
quarter on the low end and uh 5.5 on the
higher end that's that's essentially a
foregone conclusion right uh so but
anyway what do we have here so they talk
about after these two more Cuts they
think the FED will pause so they're
setting this up to say that okay June
pause and then March of of next year
that's when they actually think you get
your first cut and you're gonna start
seeing 25 BP hikes or Cuts rather now
this is pretty far out so what we've
noticed is that everything has taken a
lot longer than expected unfortunately
uh and patience is really really
important in this sort of Market but if
this ends up playing out uh the way it's
expected here as long as people continue
to have money to spend between now and
then
yeah
we could be okay in in a crazy way we
could be okay to sustain this economy
out of a recession it would be I'll tell
you it like fate loves irony as Elon
Musk always says it would be the most
ironic thing to see that the most
predicted recession
and the steepest hiking cycle in in 40
years
does not end up turning into a recession
yeah I that Jerome Powell will go down
as an absolute hero now I've also been
reading some fed papers and it's
important to to remember because some
people keep talking to me about like oh
the fed's definitely going to rug pull
us I'm like I don't know man the FED is
pretty acutely aware
of of the pain that their activity
causes in fact let me get to the
conclusion on this paper I was just
reading this this morning here look at
this my favorite line was actually right
here where they said such policies uh in
in other words if you okay so they talk
about keeping rates for too low for too
long blah blah but anyway if if you
create the risks of financial crises
uh then you want to avoid creating the
risks of financial crises because of the
social political and economic costs that
come with them and I thought that was
fascinating because it really shows sort
of the fed's awareness this is a Fed
paper by the way it shows the fed's uh
awareness of of look you know if you
tighten too hard people lose their jobs
people go bankrupt you ruin businesses
that potentially could have otherwise
thrived so you really impact humans uh
you you create misery and depression and
increase suicides right like it's
terrible to put people through a a nasty
recession right this is the Fed
themselves does not want to have to pull
vulceros because the costs are too high
it also hurts our standing of the US
dollar and and then of course it hurts
the long-term economic uh prosperity of
America as well anywho continuing on
here fed has made less progress towards
disinflation than previously thought for
any additional insight into the main
meeting we would need to see the
evidence that the re-acceleration is
real this is basically saying look for
us to even remotely think we're going to
end up getting uh 50 BP we're going to
have to somehow prove that oh yeah
everything's re-accelerating and even if
you look at Costco's earnings call from
the second you're not look you're
obviously seeing that prices have gone
up uh but uh they're not meaningfully
continuing in fact most companies even
Costco aren't talking about more future
uh you know hikes for wages instead what
are they talking about they're talking
about autonomy and efficiency I'll just
read it to you because I'm not gonna I'm
not making this up look at this
notwithstanding the two to three
off-season wage increases we had over
the last 15 months
uh we are our which has impacted some
slight D leverage D leverage basically
this gets a little complicated D
leverage means basically their Opex and
their cost of goods sold went up a
little bit higher than the rate that
Revenue increased so notwithstanding
this information given that we've only
slightly deleveraged is actually pretty
impressive given that labor is our
biggest expense so then what do they
talk about they don't talk about more
wage increases instead they talk about
it's our productivity we're getting
better at productivity and then over
here you have an analyst that's saying
so if compensation is rising six percent
and inflation like nominal prices are
going up six percent for goods but
traffic is only up three percent then
that means you should be seeing revenues
down three percent right he's basically
saying six and six
with offset by three shouldn't be a
negative three right and they're
responding well people are spending more
money on more expensive things so not
necessarily uh in other words not simply
price inflation it's mix now mix is a
really important phrase to remember when
you're talking about Finance because
it's basically saying people are buying
higher margin items at Costco rather
than somewhere else so that's good
that's a benefit to a car score that
actually shows some level of pricing
power that can increase average selling
prices they're not actually just talking
about increasing prices in fact when
they're asked about the elasticity of
price they say well we don't really
analyze price elasticity we basically
just focus on this if we lower prices we
do more sales
so I think it's really interesting
because if you go through the earnings
call and I'm just going to sum it up
because it's a little Arcane but if I
make it simple the simplest way to put
it is Costco is telling you in my
opinion basically the same thing that
almost every other company is they're
telling you look yeah we had to raise
prices but you know what we're doing now
we're focusing on the fact that if we
want more Revenue we could lower prices
if we want more margin we focus on
productivity and automating that's
really what you're seeing at almost
every single company that I've been
analyzing I'm trying to find where that
automate here it is oh found it look at
this uh so inflation has gone up we know
that it's gone up in the past we know
that and I think the focus now this is
important now what are they focus on is
trying to figure out how to do things
more efficiently one of the things we do
religiously every four weeks at the
budget meeting is the operators are
talking about certain Focus items
whether it's improving overtime hours in
other words cutting those or things
we've done to automate something
physically improving the flow of goods
in the warehouse so what is pretty much
everyone talking about everyone's
talking about
efficiency automating becoming more
productive that's what everyone's
talking about nobody's talking about hey
we still got a lot more uh you know wage
inflation to pass on we still got a lot
more price increases ahead of us and if
anything they're like yeah like if you
want to increase Revenue we could just
cut prices
in my opinion that's actually very
bullish and and that's it's very bullish
because it shows even though we're going
to go through some volatile hell over
the next bit here it's very bullish
because the last thing you want is
evidence that companies are starting to
make you think Paul volcker is coming
right this is stuff we look at almost on
a daily basis in our course member live
streams when we do fundamental analysis
we try to understand what kind of
pricing power do companies have I
encourage you to join those by the way
any of the programs comes with lifetime
access to the course member live streams
but anyway to me this is fantastic this
is very good it's also fantastic that uh
Goldman Sachs for the first time ever
has just turned bullish on Apple saying
it has a 32 upside from here 199 dollar
price Target they talk about apples
widening and increasing install base
basically leading to this moat of people
not leaving Apple uh and uh really the
more people the Venus fly trap in the
better that was pretty interesting
so uh we'll see we'll see uh but uh
pretty excited about that uh you know I
know I know some people here uh say
things like Paul volcker can't save us
either I I mean what I always respond to
stuff like this is hey uh what evidence
do you have like where where where is
the bad because I'm I'm looking for it
and people send it to me and then I make
a video on it explaining how what they
think is bad is actually not that bad
you know that's all that's all like
usually the bear argument is but but the
prices are still up like 10 I'm like
yeah no [ __ ]
that's how inflation Works stuff gets
more expensive
done
you know like uh it's it what's what
matters is the stickiness of that right
so
um
someone here writes Costco croissants
are so good wow yeah you mean like in
those the white clam shells that were
the clear clam shells where you kind of
get like that giant box right sup
investment Joy what's up man
investment I love this guy uh I gotta
come back to Chillicothe and visit you
super curious what happens if rates hold
with 32 trillion debt you can't tax your
way out of a one trillion dollar Debt
Service yeah here's here's the and it's
it's totally understandable because
central banks are losing money like hand
over fist right now because the yields
they're getting on their Investments are
substantially lower than what they're
having to pay out in the overnight repo
facility and really what happens is
that's where politicians sort of just
basically write a blank check to to
print more money and offset those losses
now that sounds ironic because it's sort
of like hey but if you print more money
doesn't that create more inflation not
necessarily if that money isn't being
then circulated through the economy if
it's just going to sort of potentially
pay off this deficit that the FED has
created uh and and the idea there is
well well then won't people lose trust
in the institution of America well yeah
eventually I mean at some point in the
long term every currency generally tends
to go to zero because its government
loses power power and Trust
but in the near term I don't think it's
likely that that's actually something
that's going to you know sort of destroy
our economy I think people have people
are so much better off today in in
aggregate not everyone obviously uh than
they were before the pandemic that uh
that that really uh once we get back to
a normalized economy I don't think that
uh markets will terribly care about the
rejiggering that happens at the FED
don't get me wrong there'll be some fun
things that are going on over there but
another thing to keep in mind too is
that not uh every set of interest uh or
or debt essentially the bond or the the
our government has is uh attached to the
interest rates that are being paid today
right so you got two institutions you've
got our government and you've got the
fed the vet is paying money hand over
Fists in the repo facility like they're
losing money right the government has a
lot of their debt uh that needs to roll
into higher yielding debt and so it
basically means the average interest
paid is actually still very low for the
for the U.S government in fact if you
look at here we can look this up St
Louis Fred
uh debt payments as a percentage of GDP
it's still lower than where we were in
the 90s interest as a percentage of GDP
all right so look at this this chart
goes all the way back to the 1940s right
so going back to the 1940s what do you
have over here you actually have in the
1990s our interest rate or or the
interest we were paying as a percentage
of GDP was basically around three
percent so in other words we're paying
three percent uh of our GDP towards
interest right now we're only paying
about 1.86 or roughly half
of our GDP and interest now that is
expected to go up but even if it goes
back up to the 90s did we really have an
economic Calamity in the 90s
not really in fact many say to 1994 was
really aligned with a soft Landing yeah
you had a technical recession in 91 but
it's not one ever ever taught anyone
ever talks about because it's really not
that big of a deal so uh I think that's
pretty fascinating yeah so we'll see hey
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