Adopt Your Own Gold and Silver Standard. Don't Wait for Government to Fix Things | Stefan Gleason

As far as wors goes, uh I did when I

spoke to him, I spoke to him at a

private reception and then um and then

also asked him a question uh during the

ComX gold dinner that was in New York

City about 8 years ago or so. And I

asked him the question I said um you

know Mr. Worsh what? And this was in the

public forum. So there are about a

thousand people there and I said so what

is the US government involved in the

gold market and if it is involved what

are the purposes of those transactions

and it was very interesting kind of

danced around he basically said he kind

of started by saying well it's not as

much as you would expect and by the way

the US dollar is very important to

maintain strength and and the IMF does

play a role in the currency markets and

so forth. And it was sort of a you know

I I took it as a yes the US government

is involved in the gold market and and

he would know and but he did kind of try

to

manco 64 home of alternative economics

and contrarian views. Today I have a new

guest. It's Stefan Gleason. He's the

president and CEO of moneymmetals.com.

And uh he was referred to me or

introduced to me by JP Cortez who runs

the sound money defense leak. And uh

yeah, JP said uh you you want to talk to

uh Stefan because he has some really

interesting insights on the precious

metals market on the sound money

question and on what's going on right

now in terms of uh yeah the refineries

and um and a crazy volatile market. So,

uh, Stefan, welcome to the channel.

>> Well, it's great to be on, Mario. I'

I've been watching your show for for

years. So, it's great to meet you

finally and and talk talk about this

very exciting market we're in right now.

>> Yeah, very I mean, on the day we're

speaking here, it's Friday, uh, January

30th. Uh, the precious metals have been

all over the place in the last few days.

We made an all-time high in gold and

silver and now we're testing 5,000 and

100 um respectively in gold and silver.

We've had uh President Trump nominate

his pick for the chairmanship of the

Federal Reserve. Maybe we could start

with that because you you told me just

before we started that you've met Kevin

Moore, so maybe you've got the inside

scoop.

>> Yeah. So I it's interesting. I guess

that's being discussed as the catalyst

for the big correction here and you know

the thought that he might be a little

tighter. Um then maybe the other options

would be I don't know about that. I mean

he he's he's a he's been around for a

while. He's he's a pretty smart guy. He

was actually considered in the last

administration to be the chairman and he

was he was passed over for Powell. Um

but I met him right around that time

actually. and uh you know he goes back

he was involved in the in the Fed uh 20

15 20 years ago as well and he he was

one of the architects of the

quantitative easing thing that was done

in 2008. So he he knows all about

printing money knows all about using the

machinery of the Federal Reserve to uh

stimulate and to counteract the business

cycle and all the things that they do

that is causing these distortions. So I

don't I don't really expect that we're

going to be seeing any anything other

than doubbishness from from this guy or

the Trump Fed in general. Uh and frankly

with the debt burdens that the the

economy has I just don't see how they

have any choice and and and of course

the US government debt situation. Um so

it's interesting there's a quick you

know sort of u you know corre correction

down here on the news. I I think that's

just you know taking out some of the air

out of the balloon. I mean gosh I mean

it's been so incredibly uh almost

parabolic what's been happening

especially with silver. So a little bit

of a cool off is probably healthy and

that was the excuse. But but as far as

Worsh goes, I did when I spoke to him, I

spoke to him at a private reception and

then um and then also asked him a

question uh during the ComX gold dinner

that was in New York City about 8 years

ago or so. And I asked him the question

I said um you know Mr. Worsh what? And

this was in the public forum. So there

are about a thousand people there and I

said so what is the US government

involved in the gold market and if it is

involved what are the purposes of those

transactions and it was very interesting

kind of danced around he basically said

he kind of started by saying well it's

not as much as you would expect and by

the way the US dollar is very important

to maintain strength and and the IMF

does play a role in the currency markets

and so forth. And it was sort of a you

know I I took it as a yes the government

is involved in the gold market and and

he would know and but he did kind of try

to diminish how important that was or

how much that was. So I thought that was

really interesting. Um so but as far as

the plan for for Worsh I mean yeah we

you know we're going to see a lot of

inflation regardless. So it's just we'll

see how this works out over the next few

days. Uh but uh but interesting news.

He's been around for a while. He was

thought to be the front front runner.

>> Yeah. and and I I've read that

apparently he wants to cut rates but he

wants to decrease the size of the

balance sheet which was

ballooned by uh starting with QE no wait

when he was uh uh in the board of

governors but uh you can say that really

and still when push comes to shove he

he'll start printing because I remember

Ben Bernani uh being uh questioned by

Ron Paul in Congress just after they

started QE in 0908

and uh he said, "Oh, don't worry. Uh

we're going to taper everything back. We

we we'll do just a trillion." And here

we are. Um and we're like at around 7

trillion still, but uh yeah, it's like

you said, it doesn't matter who's Fed

chairman. U the fiat dollar is going to

continue to be u debased. And it's a

good thing that the stackers are being

rewarded for that. And I have to I have

to admit, but uh we can't lose sight of

the um idea of sound money as well, I

think. And uh maybe we could segue into

that because it's not just important for

the US, but for the whole of the world

that um we have sound money. Yeah. It's

really nice for us to be able to do well

with our gold and silver, but we want uh

Yeah. a system that doesn't rob

everyone.

>> Yeah. Yeah. It's quite an immoral

system. And you know, on the the topic

of the central bankers, I think it was

Alan Binder who said that the last duty

of a central banker is to tell the

truth. So, it was kind of an

interesting, you know, so this idea that

we're going to shrink the balance sheet.

Yeah. I mean, they need to say that, but

uh I, you know, I really doubt they

will. Um and they've they've said that

before. Um, but as far as sound money

goes, uh, of course people don't have to

wait for the system to be fixed. They

don't have to, uh, look for a, uh, a new

monetary system or the central banks to

suddenly act uh, responsibly again, but

really they they can go on their own

personal gold standard and and that's

what people are doing. And those who've

had the foresight to do that have been

richly rewarded in the last two or three

years and and validated for for what

they've been saying. I'm really

optimistic that the not just what's been

developing in the precious metals

market, but just I think there's a

growing awareness out there in the

public of that there's something

horribly wrong with our money and that

the system is broken. They may not have

figured out exactly why that is yet, but

they're starting to take action. And

just in the last few weeks, few months,

especially with the rise of silver,

we've seen a huge new influx of people

wanting to get physical gold and silver

for themselves. in in in a way that you

know maybe it's going from 1 to two or 2

to 3%. uh which is still a very small

number but I think it's really promising

but you know going to the policy side uh

money metals my company has been heavily

involved in public policy at the state

and federal level here in the US and we

are seeing more and more momentum and

you've had JP on there to talk about

some of the bills and and things that

that we're involved with through the

sound money defense league but we are

seeing a lot more excitement and

enthusiasm at the state level in

particular among policy makers to try to

do some of the things that they can do w

within their states to minimize the the

really deleterious effects of the

federal reserve system and and what's

happening at the federal level. And so

that that in involves, you know,

policies to remove income tax from

precious metals, sales tax, encouraging

states to hold gold as a reserve asset,

uh removing regulation on local dealers.

There's all kinds of things that kind of

discriminate and and make it harder for

them to do business, get them involved

with the police and turning over

information to their about their

customers. So there's been reforms in

that area. There's a lot more work to

do. So there's many things there's many

things we can go down the list and I

know JP went into detail but we are

seeing a lot more in uh excitement at

this at the at the state level. At the

same time, some of the ideas that have

been coming in by people who are

well-intentioned are we think are

actually quite problematic and that and

that involves the state governments

getting involved in joint ventures in

public private partnerships with gold

businesses that are trying to sort of

get special recognition to compete

against everyone else in some sort of uh

payment scheme or depository scheme. So,

we're not in favor of that. We think

that's not what people want. They don't

want the government in the middle of

their gold, involved with their gold,

whether it be the federal government or

the state government. That's the whole

reason we're in this problem is

government and and the involvement and

and and of course the currency

situation. So, putting the government

back in the middle of go, people's gold

is not what we think is a good idea. And

so, we're trying to encourage states to

avoid these ideas. Just because it's a

gold bill doesn't mean it's good. Um and

but on on the whole it's very exciting

because in general we're getting so much

support for really good reforms and and

seeing a lot of progress there.

>> Yeah. Would you say the uh role of

government should be minimal minimal and

like just related to the treasury and

the mint? Uh I mean that's how it used

to be. You'd be able take your jewelry

and say can you mint a coin for me? And

they do it and take 1% senior right.

>> That's exactly right. in in the in the

Coinage Act of 1792 and in the US

Constitution, the role of government was

simply to be uh there as a way of maybe

helping to standardize weights and

measures and you would bring in your

gold and you could have it coined for

free. You could go to a private mint.

They could coin a dollar coin or a $10

coin privately. You'd have to pay a fee

there. The US government offered free

senorage. Basically, they'll standardize

and give you back your gold. So their

their role is not to monkey around with

the value of the money, monkey around

with paper money uh and set up a a

national bank. Their val their role is

simply to be uh maybe a party that

people can go to to standardize their

gold that circulates privately. And and

so the idea that we need to run to

government to run a monetary system,

even if it's a gold related monetary

system, makes no sense. And we we just

think the government should stay out and

let these things happen in the private

sector. and they already are and there's

plenty of services and and capabilities

available privately. We don't need the

government to get into partnerships with

gold businesses.

>> Yeah. And uh the history is interesting

because prior to the uh legal tender

act, I think it was 1861 or two during

the civil war, there was no legal tender

act. And some people still using like

Mexican silver dollars or

>> European gold coins. You just had to

like Yeah, that's what it should be, a

free market,

>> right? Right. And basically before uh

even the US mint and and there was

plenty of other and and for for decades

was plenty of other circulating dollars

because the dollar was simply a weight

of silver, a particular standardized

amount of silver was known as a dollar.

And the main the main coin at the time,

I think in circulation around the time

the founding of of the US was the

Spanish mil dollar, which was one of the

more popular the pieces of aid. It could

be broken. Uh, and so yeah, it's just

the the idea that the government gets to

define what a dollar is and change what

a dollar is. The dollar was simply just

a of a certain weight of silver. And

it's interesting because you mentioned

legal tender. That's a really great

point. I mean, that it was legal tender

laws were created to apply government

force to try to make things money that

were not money. And that was done during

the civil war when they did the green

back which was unbacked paper money and

they tried to circulate it out. They

basically you know passed it into

circulation a counterfeit form of money

and because it would not be accepted

because it wasn't gold. They then used

government force and said no legal

tender this is equal under the law and

shall be recognized as such. So the

whole notion of legal tender is

basically a a creation of government

force to prop up something that isn't

inherently money.

>> Yeah. Fiat currency I guess need needs

the legal tender support. Um

okay let's uh switch over more to uh

like the market right now. What's

happening? And uh maybe you you know you

are you're in the middle of the action

there with the metals and and uh JP also

told me that you've got probably are you

building or you have the biggest

depository in North America more

advanced than Fort Knox.

>> Yeah. We don't know if there's anything

in Fort Knox, do we?

>> No. And there's a bill actually we're

working with Senator Lee in Utah who's a

US senator and and Congressman Massie on

a on a audit the gold bill because there

hasn't been a credit credible audit for

decades. There hasn't been an ever an

examination or disclosure into any

incumbrances that the US gold reserves

may have as it been pledged lease

swapped. I mean Kevin worst seemed to

indicate that there was some activity

going on on the financial side with our

with our gold reserves uh whether it be

the IMF or the exchange stabilization

fund. So there's a bill to audit the US

gold reserves uh which you know is is is

certainly needed. Um but and is an

example why the government's a bad

steward. The government doesn't do a

good job. So the Money Metals Exchange

has another affiliated business called

Money Metals Depository. And we built

the largest class 3 vault in North

America other than the New York Fed

which is technically larger from what I

understand. We our vault is about 9,000

square ft. It's actually four vaults

class 3 which is the highest rating. Um,

and and Fort Knox is only 4,000 square

ft. So that, you know, we're able to say

we're twice as big as Fort Knox. But

more importantly, we're, you know, our

our our we're a private firm. We have

audits. There's there's actual

accountability. Everything is handled

under a camera, dual controls,

background checks, multiple layers of

physical and electronic security, all

kinds of technology. Um, but you know,

we have a lot of silver and that's very

bulky. Um, it's kind of interesting, you

know, over the years people say, "Oh,

okay. I don't want silver because it's

too bulky, you know, and and and I I

would always say, and now it's sort of

kind of coming true, is like, well,

maybe you you think that you have too

much silver when it's $20 an ounce. How

do you feel when it's 110? Like, you

know, is it too bulky still? Are you are

you are you upset that you have all this

uh all this stuff? But um anyway, Money

Metals is one of the largest uh online

dealers and retailers in the US. Um we

have over a million customers. Uh, and

you know, we store billions of dollars

in our facility of of metal. Most most

people in the US physical market, and

you're I'm sure your viewers know, most

people want to want to actually take

physical delivery. They that's why they

buy gold and silver. They want it

shipped to them. They want to have it in

their hands. That they don't want that

counterparty risk. U, they certainly

don't want the government involved with

it. But there are some some people for

various reasons whether they're in a

place where it's not as safe or they

have large amounts or that maybe they

want to have more convenience when they

want to sell back uh they would would

like to store some of their gold and

silver. We we think everybody should

have at least some in their personal

possession and so the vast majority of

our of our customers have take delivery.

But the depository is a very important

part of our business. Growing growing

rapidly all parts of our business and

really the industry right now is

incredible in terms of the amount of

growth and volume that we're all seeing

in our market. And that's having a a a

really it's causing a lot of growing

pains. It's causing issues in the supply

chain for a lot of uh dealers,

wholesalers, mints. They're running into

liquidity issues. They're running into

long lead times. The refineries in many

cases are actually not accepting silver

for refining or they're saying it's

going to be 12 weeks or 18 weeks or

we're not going to be able to pay you

for four weeks after we've finished or

received your metal. You know, all kinds

of different restrictions being put out

there. And it's it's actually cascading

down to especially the local dealers who

really rely on the refineries to to melt

down stuff when they have too much

inventory. And you know, while there is

a lot of people, there are a lot of

people, new people coming in and buying,

there's also a lot of people taking

profits, and that's causing,

particularly with silver, a a massive

sort of backlog, especially if it has to

be refined.

>> Yeah. I I mean, I I still believe silver

and gold are going to keep going higher,

but I can understand people have been

holding silver for so long uh that they

might want to sell a little bit and

especially if they need the uh funds.

That that's the great thing about gold

and silver is that it doesn't matter

what the price is, you always find u

someone to buy. I know there the local

coin shops seem to have a difficulty um

right now and they might not make a

price, but I I think you can always find

someone who's going to pay you for that.

Um and why do you think uh this is

happening? Is it because there's not

enough refineries in the US?

>> Yeah. Uh absolutely. That's one that's

one of the biggest reasons there

especially silver. Um the about 60% to

65% of the world's silver refining

capacity is actually in China. Um and so

and meanwhile there while there there

aren't like big export controls there

there's thought that that may be coming

in in China but there's already a

premium on silver and domestically in

China. And then of course if you want to

have refining a lot of folks are sending

their silver to China and so it's

sucking in the silver and then it's

going to stay there because there's no

financial incentive to send it back out

when there's a higher premium

domestically for silver. So there is a

very serious refining shortfall in the

US particularly for silver. Uh and in

fact some some of the refineries that uh

that have refined silver even for the

last year would were not accepting any

outside silver coming in and that was

really impacting the the the local scrap

collectors around the country who were

starting to have serious problems

getting their stuff refined. More

recently, some of the big refineries uh

for both gold and silver also said that

we're going to have to stop paying you

uh in advance. So, the way it works is

like if you're if you're a local coin

shop or a scrap collector, you usually

end up with a lot more metal coming in

than you're actually selling. Um we

don't have that same issue as an online

dealer. We have a lot of people buying

from us, so we have that release valve,

but people like to sell their metals

locally often, so they don't have to

ship it off. you know, they don't mind

us shipping them a box, but they're not

as excited about shipping it back. We

still have lots of people selling to us,

but it's the local uh businesses that

kind of bear the brunt of the selling.

And so, they have a huge excess of metal

coming in, which pressures down the the

bids that they're able to pay. And then

when they go to their refiners or to a

wholesaler and they find out, we're not

buying that anymore or we're not

refining that or you have to wait 12

weeks. And and by the way, if you have

to wait 12 weeks, we can't pay you till

the end when they used to be able to get

an advance when the metal showed up at

the refinery so they could go out and

buy more metal and keep the flow going.

And so one of the largest refin two of

the largest refineries in the US just

sent out notices this week saying,

"Look, we we're not accepting anything

for 3 weeks. We're completely

overwhelmed and when we start accepting

things again, we're not going to be able

to give anyone any advances and you're

going to have to finance the metal

yourself until the end of the refining

process, which by the way is taking many

more weeks than usual. And so that's

causing a big problem for the local

guys. Uh because they're not highly

capitalized businesses. Um they rely on

those advances. They rely on the quick

turn to be able to keep their business

model going. And so that's causing the

bids to drop and drop and drop. Um, and

if you can get them to buy it at all. So

it's a very interesting scenario. I

mean, it's when you have this kind of

flow and this growth happen so quickly

in a market that has been relatively

sleepy for years, um, it it just can't

be absorbed. And in my opinion, it's

just starting. I mean we're just talking

about you know going from two to 3% or 1

to two you know I don't know the numbers

exactly but it's a still a very small

number of people who have any exposure

to gold and silver and you know this

market is still in the early stages if

we have a public awakening uh and people

get into the physical market in in a

bigger way I mean we could talk you know

five 10 times multiples of volume and

there's just no way I mean we're already

at the breaking point in the industry in

terms of the the stresses around the

volume and and some dealers and

wholesalers are handling it better than

others. But uh you can definitely see

the stress across the industry right

now.

>> Yeah, maybe if there's uh more growth

like you said uh and interest the uh new

people might uh kind of help out the

local coin shops because they would go

and maybe buy more and they wouldn't

have to hold as much I guess.

>> Yeah. And that's what they rely I mean

that's if if the local dealer doesn't

have enough people buying he has this

flow and he has to flip it to a

wholesaler or or send it to a refinery

and and that's that's been the big

issue.

>> Um but it's not even just that. It's

also just the the turnaround. Uh you

know when you're buying metal and we we

get you know hundreds of boxes a day

from people shipping in to sell to us

and we've hired Money Metals has hired

65 people since Christmas in our

operation. and we need another 40 or 50

and we're desperately trying to to get

them hired um just to stay on top of the

volume. Uh which, you know, we're not

even trying to get more volume right

now. We're we're just, you know, dealing

with what we have. Um but it's quality

control. You know, the stuff comes in.

There are some fakes. You have to test

everything. Everything has to be tested

carefully under cameras. People

sometimes ship stuff in. They didn't

realize it was what it was or they

thought it was something different.

Maybe they sold you this, but it was

that. So, it's a very manual process

when you're dealing with the public who,

you know, have stuff. They've cleaned

out their their their safes or their

drawers and they're they don't know

necessarily what they have. So, there's

a lot of and occasionally fakes. I don't

want to say that's a big issue. It's

it's actually not that big of an issue,

but we are seeing a little an uptick.

Um, and it's usually folks they just

didn't know. Uh, it's not they're trying

to defraud us or or anyone, but the

point is it's it's this is a physical

commodity and it takes real quality

control. uh and a responsible dealer is

going to staff that and make sure that

they check everything really carefully.

And so that's causing backlogs all over

the place.

>> How easy it is for people to like uh

ship and also how much does it cost if

someone wanted to to send you uh stuff?

>> Yeah.

>> To sell.

>> So we recommend when people ship off

gold and silver that they should use US

Postal Service registered mail. Um and

the reason is because you can buy

insurance through registered mail. If

you send it UPS or FedEx, um they don't

offer insurance for gold and silver. So,

um [clears throat] registered mail,

there's a a fee, you know, I think

they'll ship up to $50,000 of value in a

box and it'll cost you, you know,

somewhere probably

10 to 15 to $20 for the postage and then

the insurance on say 50,000 will

probably cost you another 70 or $80 or

something. Um so it it's it's

reasonable. Um, the other thing is

people need to be careful about boxing

it. They got to double box anything

that's heavy. Fill the voids. Use lots

of tape. The post office wants you to

use that paper tape and not plastic tape

to seal all the seams. So, uh, we we

have a little instructional thing that

we send out saying, "Here's how to pack

the box properly." Most people do fine.

Um, but the insurance is important and

so, uh, USPS registered mail is is the

way people do it. And and that's why

some people like to go most people I

would say like to go locally so they

don't have to ship it off. But the

problem is they tend to get paid less if

they're offered a bid at all in this

environment as for the reasons we talked

about.

>> And u in terms of like uh if I were to

keep some of my gold with you uh would I

also be able to have it uh like

delivered to me? Do you as well?

>> Yeah. So we store uh we have segregated

storage and the way that works is you

know your the metal that you purchase or

that you ship in is held in your own

physical container that's you know

sealed with a tag number and RFID and

all that stuff and it's tracked and

audited within our anytime the container

is open. It's re audited under camera

two people are involved everything is

really accountable that way. We do

internal audits we have external audits

but it's segregated and it's your

property. It's not on our balance sheet.

It's your property simply in our care

just like a safe deposit box at a bank.

Um, and so you have the right to take

delivery of it at any time. We can ship

it off to you or you could sell it back

to us or you could sell it to someone

else. You could sell it to one of our

competitors and we'll ship it to them.

So, uh, it's very it's very user

friendly that way. Um, and it's frankly

it's very it's a lot of manual work on

our end, but it's very easy for the

customer just on the website. They can

click, you know, click around a few

times and boom, it's it's sold. It's,

you know, the instructions are given or

they can call. Uh, a lot happens in the

background, but uh, but yeah, it's it's

it's pretty slick.

>> Yeah. And I think you you've been around

since what, 2010, right?

>> 2010. Yep. Yeah.

>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

So um

>> another thing that's interesting Mario

is and this is something that we're

doing uh that's really not available in

the market and that and that is

we also will lend somebody uh give them

a line of credit against their gold just

like a home equity loan. So you you have

these valuable assets that sometimes the

only most people think the only way you

can get liquidity from your gold and

silver is to sell it and that's

certainly what most people will do and

that's a good option. But one of the one

of the things is when you sell your gold

and silver, you have now possibly uh

incur created a capital gains tax event.

And so there is a scenario if for a

business purpose because we're not a

consumer lender. But if you're a small

business person or you're, you know,

have a big investment thing going on, a

real estate investor, that kind of

thing, we can actually provide people a

line of credit just like a home equity

line that's flexible, secured by their

own physical gold or silver in our

depository. And so we're seeing a lot of

interest in that these days because

people for one, they're sitting on more

equity, you know, in their metals, and

two, they they they may be concerned

about selling it or they don't want to

sell it. uh and incur a capital gains

tax obligation. So, there's there's some

been some interest there. It's not a

huge part of our of what we do, but it's

a nice accommodation and and it's

definitely not for everybody and and

again, it does need to be for business

purposes because we're not a consumer

lender.

>> Yeah. And I I would also emphasize to

the viewers because they might be

thinking, "Oh, what if I don't want my

gold lent?" But you you

specifically tell Stefan that you want

to lent your gold. He won't lend someone

else's gold to someone else.

>> Yeah. And and to be clear, we do not

lend gold um in any way. What we're

talking about is somebody wanting to

borrow cash against their own.

>> Uh and that and that's

>> Oh, yeah. That's right. Yeah, that's

right.

>> There are there are firms that lend gold

as a service

>> like a pond broker, right?

>> Like [clears throat] a pond broker

except that not at those kinds of

interest rates.

>> Yeah. So, so yeah, it's

>> Can you tell us what kind of rates you

charge for a lot?

>> Our rate is in the 9% range uh

annualized.

>> Right now, it's based on the prime rate.

It's a it's a margin over the prime or

above or below.

>> Um, so it's it's it's not as quite as

low as you would get for home equity

line of credit where you borrow against

your house, but uh you know, you're you

no bank will lend against your gold. I

mean, that's that's the thing. This is

really not available except through

money metals in the US market. It's big

in India. Um, that's very common for

banks to lend against uh people's own

property if they want to get a loan

against even their jewelry. Uh, but no

bank will give you a loan in the US

unless you're in a high net worth family

wealth type scenario. No bank, they

don't know how to store it. They don't

know how to verify it. They don't know

how to hold it. They don't know how to

liquidate it. Uh, in fact, they think

it's like kryptonite. You know, it's

>> India's going to start doing it with

silver as well, aren't they? This year

in April. Yep.

>> Yeah. You already do it.

>> We already do it. It's good collateral

and it's it's strictly if that person

wants to borrow against their own gold

and silver and it's in their own

segregated account in our depository and

they're offering it as collateral for

for a loan for themselves. We can do

that.

>> Okay, great. Um, what else is going on?

I mean, aside from uh what do you think

of the current market action? It just

got a bit overdone. It's just a

correction.

>> Well, you've had Michael Oliver on your

show. I I I uh really think that he's on

to something with the whole notion about

silver moving into a new reality. I

think that that's I think he's right. I

think he's been proven right so far. You

know, hasn't reached the levels he's

talking about, but I could see that

happening. I I think there's there's

clearly a shift uh and both in

psychology and just in demand trends,

and it's feeding on itself. Um, and it's

dri the what we're seeing in silver is

clearly being driven by market

tightness. I mean, we're heavily

involved in the US physical market.

We're involved in taking deliveries off

the exchange. We know what's happening

in the US market. We've seen the

premiums uh in London. We've seen the

premiums in Asia. We were actually

dealing there were some folks in Dubai

and India who were screaming you know

pounding the table needing silver and we

were shipping pallets of silver to India

because they was such a high premium

that it made financial sense for them

and us to do to do a transaction. So

there's clearly a lot of demand

happening and in especially outside of

the US uh and it's that you see that in

the premiums. Um, and so I think I think

that, you know, getting through the $50

level, I think that that, you know, has

silver's been kind of behind all the

other metals and it's playing catch-up.

And I I think he's right about what he's

saying and

>> and we'll see. But, uh, it's been it's

been a huge it's been a credible ride so

far.

>> I agree. And the other thing is the more

valuable silver becomes, the more of a

monetary aspect it it gets because I

I've been hearing that even central

banks now uh and sovereign wealth funds

are starting to buy silver because it's

not as bulky anymore.

>> Yeah.

>> Silver silver always plays catch up in a

bull market. Yeah. You know, you

mentioned the the the the higher value

attracting more interest. There's even a

an economic principle or or I guess it's

a it's a circumstance. It's called a a

gifin good. And so silver I think is

acting like a gifin good. And in the in

the sense that it's the perceived

inferior good you know with gold being

the superior, silver being the inferior.

Uh and people are switching to it and as

the price rises it rises more quickly

than gold and then it rises even more as

it rises because people continue

switching to it. And you know, one of

the classic examples is the potato

famine in Ireland where, you know, meat

became so expensive, people switched to

potatoes, potatoes started going up. The

more the potatoes went up, the more

people wanted potatoes. And so it's this

the law of demand is actually

counteracted or broken in this scenario

of a gifing good where higher prices

actually results in more demand and not

less. And you know, and we're seeing it

not just from an investment standpoint

between gold and silver, but you're also

seeing it in the context of, you know,

uh, concerns around supply where people

are are saying, you know, we need to

have more silver on hand for our

manufacturing purposes. We're seeing

what's happening. There's real tightness

and so the shortages beget more

shortages and that and people start

having instead of 3 weeks of supply

might have three months of supply on the

shelf because they're not going to stop

their their manufacturing process over

silver which is a small component one of

the small inputs. So I think there's

just a lot happening in the physical

market. This is very much a demanddriven

situation and then you run that up

against the supply situation which is

also highly inelastic. Uh, and the fact

that so much of silver is a byproduct

does, you know,$1, $200 silver doesn't

necessarily result in much more or any

more silver supply coming out of zinc

and copper mines and that it's such a

hard business already in mining, such a

long lead time. And then you add the

fact that there's almost no primary

silver mines, you know, 30% of them. So,

there's just a very interesting

combination. You know, we've been

talking about these, you've been talking

about these factors for years, and it

never seemed to matter. you know we you

know it's like wow this is an explosive

situation

>> now it's happening

>> yeah fine it's happening and uh people

who don't understand what what has been

happening and what's happening now uh

they [clears throat] keep trying to call

tops and I think they're going to be

wrong uh anyway uh Stephan I really

enjoyed speaking with you and uh we

should do it again in the near future

and uh thank you for coming on my

channel

>> my pleasure great to be here thanks

Mario

>> you're welcome