How to Build Extreme Willpower | David Goggins & Dr. Andrew Huberman

I'm going to share a little neuroscience tidbit.

Love it.

But I think it's one that you'll appreciate.

Most people don't know this,

but there's a brain structure

called the anterior midcingulate cortex,

as we pointed out before, that's a noun, it's a name,

it doesn't mean anything.

Right. We could call it

the cookie monster.

Right.

But what's interesting about this brain area

is there's now a lot of data,

in humans, not some mouse study,

showing that when people do something they don't want to do,

like add three hours of exercise per day or per week,

or when people who are trying to diet and lose weight

resist eating something.

Right.

When people do anything that they,

and this is the important part,

that they don't want to do,

it's not about adding more work,

it's about adding more work that you don't want to do.

Yes.

This brain area gets bigger.

Yep.

Now here's what's especially interesting

about this brain area to me, and by the way,

I'm only learning this recently

because it's new data, but there's a lot of it.

The anterior midcingulate cortex

is smaller in obese people,

it gets bigger when they diet.

It's larger in athletes,

it's especially large or grows larger

in people that see themselves

as challenged and overcome some challenge.

Right.

And in people that live a very long time,

this area keeps its size.

In many ways, scientists are starting to think

of the anterior midcingulate cortex

not just as one of the seats of willpower.

Right.

But perhaps actually the seat of the will to live.

See, now we're talking.

And when I learned about the anterior midcingulate cortex,

I was like almost out of my seat.

And I've been in the neuroscience game since I was 20.

Now we're talking. And we're the same age.

And I was so pumped

'cause I've heard of the amygdala fear, prefrontal cortex,

it's planning and action.

I could tell you every brain area and every,

I teach neuroanatomy to medical students.

But when I started seeing the data

on the anterior midcingulate cortex,

I was like, whoa, this is interesting.

Yep.

And all the data points to the fact

that we can build this area up.

Yep.

But that, as quickly as we build it up,

if we don't continue to invest in things

that are hard for us that we don't want to do,

that's the part that feels so Goggin-esque.

Yes, sir. To me,

that we don't want to do,

like if you love the ice bath,

"Yeah, I love the ice bath,"

and you go from one minute to 10 minutes, guess what?

Your anterior midcingulate cortex did not grow.

None.

But if you hate the cold water,

if you're afraid of drowning and you get into water

and put your head under.

Yep.

Then your anterior mid, and survive,

then the anterior midcingulate cortex gets bigger.

But if you don't do it the next day,

or if you do it the next day and you enjoy it

because, hey, hey, I did it yesterday,

woo-hoo, happy me, Merry Christmas,

as you would say. That's right,

Merry Christmas.

Guess what?

The anterior midcingulate cortex shrinks again.

DAVID: Yep.

To me, this is one of the most important discoveries

that neuroscience has ever made

because it's that I don't want to do something

but do it anyway.

That's right.

That grows this area,

and it's almost like I have a friend,

he's been sober 30 years from alcohol,

and he always says, you know,

the amazing thing about addiction is there's a cure,

the problem is it only works one day at a time.

Yep.

And so, you have to renew it every day.

That's right.

So the anterior midcingulate cortex to me,

when I learned about it, two things went off in my head,

whoa, this is super interesting,

and two, I got to tell David Goggins about this.

And I waited until now.

I'm glad. To tell you

because I felt like, well, for obvious reasons,

I wanted to tell you and I wanted to tell you here.

Well, I love that

because that's how I've lived my entire life,

I didn't know anything about that.

But people go, "Man, you have such a strong will."

It's something that you build, like I never forgot,

I was on a podcast one time, and this dude goes,

"You were blessed with a strong mind."

Like, the hell you talking about

I was blessed with a strong mind?

That's something that you have to develop.

You develop that over years, decades of suffering

and going back into the suffer.

That's why a lot of people who graduate Navy SEAL training,

I talk about very openly all the time,

a lot of guys don't want to go back into that water,

don't want to go back into the hard stuff.

Anything hard, anything hard in life,

once you get through it, it's like you become a POW.

Like, how many POWs you know want to go back to POW camp?

None.

When something sucks so bad in life, this is on this,

that we're talking about now, very few people want to go back.

They're happy they graduated.

I realized I'm the same way, I don't want to go back.

I have to go back, I must go back.

Because that is exactly where

all the knowledge of my life exists was back there

and what exactly what you're talking about.

Well, I didn't know anything about this,

but how I grew a will was constantly doing these things,

so now, it's just life.

I wake up, while it still sucks, it's just life.

You don't sit back and like, oh my God,

like I have days I don't want to do it,

but I know I'm going to do it.

I know from years of just doing it, so that's beautiful.

And this is why I came on here with you today,

and I'm glad that you're talking about this

because human beings need to hear this,

they need to stop hearing these hacks on this and that,

there's no fucking hack, bro,

there's no fucking hack,

yeah, you may this and that and saunas and this,

all this shit that they, yeah, it's great.

There is no fucking life hack.

To grow that thing, how do you grow it?

Do it, and do it, and do it and do it.

That's the hack, the hack is going to fucking suck.

And that's when I realized, that's when I realized.

That's why I wanted to come on here today,

I didn't want to come on here

and talk about no fucking passion and purpose

and how to get the fuck out of bed

and how to hit a fucking alarm clock

and all this catchphrase bullshit,

'cause that wasn't how I lived, it wasn't how I lived.

I lived, I woke up like every human being does

and goes, "Fuck, man, I'm a fucking piece of shit today.

How the hell is this going to work out for me?"

And you fight that and you fight that,

you don't override it, there's no override button.

It's the conversation in your head.

So how do you do that?

We don't have enough of these conversations

about the real conversation that every human being is having

and they have no idea how to get out of it, but they do.

It's that shit right there, man, you got to build your will.

How do you build your will? Exactly what you said, man.

Exactly what you said.

Well, I feel like knowing the name of something,

anterior midcingulate cortex

doesn't fundamentally change us.

But one thing I like about biology is that, willpower,

if somebody feels they don't have it,

feels like this thing that other people have.

But everybody, unless they're brain damaged,

like a hole through their head

has two anterior midcingulate cortex,

one on each side of their brain.

Everyone has one, they have two.

So I feel like it's just a question of opening the portal,

and the portal, again, I'm going to say it 10 times

and forgive me, is I think people go,

"Oh, I do hard things, I do sets to failure,

and then I do forced reps."

I love training with weights, I love doing sets to failure,

I even like forced reps, but guess what?

I like forced reps, so I'll tell you,

they don't build my anterior midcingulate cortex.